Charles H. Roemer's Affidavit and Testimony on a 1942-43 Meeting with Vandiver Brown (1942)

Sworn accounts given in 1982 and 1984 by Charles H. Roemer, a New Jersey attorney, of a meeting he said took place in 1942 or 1943 at Johns-Manville's New York headquarters. Roemer, then counsel to the Union Asbestos and Rubber Company (Unarco), went with two of its plant managers to ask how J-M handled workers whose X-rays showed asbestos disease. In his affidavit he swore that Vandiver Brown said it was J-M's policy "not to do anything nor to tell the employees of the x-ray findings" and "to let them work until they quit work because of asbestosis or died as a result of asbestos-related diseases." In his deposition he testified that when he asked whether they would let the men work until they dropped dead, one of the Browns answered, "Yes. We save a lot of money that way."

What it shows

The affidavit was sworn in September 1982 for an adversary proceeding in J-M's Chapter 11 case (McLoughlin v. Johns-Manville, No. 82-6037, Bankruptcy Court, Southern District of New York); the deposition was taken April 25, 1984, in Johns-Manville's suit against the United States in the U.S. Claims Court. Roemer said the meeting followed findings by his cousin, Dr. Jacob Roemer, of lung changes in the X-rays of five or six Unarco workers, whom the doctor urged be told. Besides Vandiver Brown, Roemer recalled J-M's president, whose name he could not remember but agreed "might have been" Louis Brown; J-M's president then was Lewis H. Brown. These are recollections given about 40 years later, and J-M's lawyer objected to parts of the questioning. See also Roemer Deposition.

In Johns-Manville's chronology

Johns-Manville's own chronology of what the company knew describes this document as follows:

Roemer claims Vandiver Brown and J-M's president, L.H. Brown, told him then that employees were not told of risk, or of disease, due to litigation potential. Roemer claims he also talked to Lanza, who was uncooperative.